Curse

Mr. Matt · Aug 11, 2005, 04:34 PM // 16:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silmor

But whether or not the issue is acted upon isn't the thing here. What I'm trying to say is that someone who unlocked all skills (which takes a lot longer than just finishing the game twice), has a lot more say about whether or not the skill unlocking mechanism is good. That's actual playing experience right there, and as such a valuable source of information to ArenaNet. Whether or not ArenaNet decides to address these complaints is something else entirely - the complaint can't just be dismissed (in the case of UAS, the typical fanboi dismissal was "you're just lazy!", which to someone who unlocked close to or all of the skills is just hilarious).

Sure, there are still a lot of players taking their time moving through the game, and as long as they have lots of terrain and story to explore, I'm sure they won't understand why people are upset about being bored, or about grinding, or whatever. They won't support UAS (or any other measure to improve item/skill unlocking, because things are fine! - UAS is the most extreme example of a suggestion, and as such a rather lousy example of a typical complaint). Does this group count as much as the people who did play through the entire game several times already? The latter group contains both satisfied and dissatisfied players, don't get me wrong - just saying they would actually know what they're talking about.

There's a simple saying in customer feedback: 5% of dissatisfied customers will complain. The rest will leave and not come back. This is why I think it's not wise to dismiss the complaints of a minority simply because there are many satisfied people still playing.

I'm not suggesting their complaints be dismissed at all, I'm suggesting that their complaints be aired in a more constructive manner. There may well be a valid issue with any criticism, drastic or minuscule, but as I've said, coming to a forum and simply saying 'ANET ARE LIARS! THEY PROMISED NO GRIND BUT THERE IS! I HATE YOU AND WILL NEVER PLAY YOUR GAME AGAIN!' serves no purpose whatsoever. That's not criticism, that's just bitching. And that's the only reason I use the UAS issue as an example -- it's the most common issue to be expressed in the least constructive manner.

I have no problem whatsoever with criticism of anything, and will always correct someone if they say that something is 'perfect' as that serves no purpose either. My problem lies with the people who decide to express their problems in a wholly negative way, and with no concern for any other players.

Xonic · Aug 11, 2005, 04:35 PM // 16:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Myth Osis

Am I the only person that loves this game.

There are at least 2, counting me in.

Algren Cole · Aug 11, 2005, 04:37 PM // 16:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silmor

Gee, most of the people who didn't leave the game yet are still having fun? No kidding, Einstein. That remains true even if 99% of the players already quit the game - the remaining 1% still has fun, so it's a rather pathetic argument why ArenaNet shouldn't worry about people being dissatisfied.

the argument is that you are in the minority....this forum is in the minority. We comprise less than 1% of the total Guild Wars community....the other 99.x% haven't felt the need to find a forum on which they can bitch and moan about the games shortcomings...therefore Guild Wars is doing pretty well.

Aniewiel · Aug 11, 2005, 04:40 PM // 16:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Matt

My problem lies with the people who decide to express their problems in a wholly negative way, and with no concern for any other players.

This is the point that many here have tried to make over and over. NO ONE discounts the idea that things need improvement. What turns a lot of would-be supporters off to these very valid concerns is the way in which those concerns are presented. Not only are a lot of posts about improvements filled with vitriolic language, cursing and condescending language, they also lambast those of us who, for the most part, still enjoy the game. As soon as I see "carebear" and "n00b" or words to that effect, I stop reading.

I love the game (so that makes at least 3 of us! LOL!) and still agree that there is great room for improvement.

EtrnalXellotath · Aug 11, 2005, 04:44 PM // 16:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyeo138

Hi, my name is Kyeo138, and I love Guild Wars.

::drone like voices echo:: Hi, Kyeo138

(Did he just start a 12-step program for Guild Wars...? O.o)

stumpy · Aug 11, 2005, 04:45 PM // 16:45

there is always room for improvement ... "take that old calculator and through a clock in it ... call it a ... computer"

anyways that makes 4 ... I still play every night ... I have a full time job but still manage to clear 850 hours since release. I know, I am not sure how either ... but I love the game so ... why not ...

Silmor · Aug 11, 2005, 04:46 PM // 16:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

the argument is that you are in the minority....this forum is in the minority. We comprise less than 1% of the total Guild Wars community....the other 99.x% haven't felt the need to find a forum on which they can bitch and moan about the games shortcomings...therefore Guild Wars is doing pretty well.

Like I said, most people just leave without a word. Others don't like reading forums, let alone post on them. Claiming this '99.x%' are all satisfied with Guild Wars is preposterous; if anything, take this forum's population as a representative sample of the Guild Wars population, i.e. a standalone percentage of people who enjoy Guild Wars enough to frequent forums about it.

Algren Cole · Aug 11, 2005, 04:50 PM // 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silmor

Like I said, most people just leave without a word. Others don't like reading forums, let alone post on them. Claiming this '99.x%' are all satisfied with Guild Wars is preposterous; if anything, take this forum's population as a representative sample of the Guild Wars population, i.e. a standalone percentage of people who enjoy Guild Wars enough to frequent forums about it.

I didn't say 99.x% are satisfied. I said 99.x% is comprised of Adults who don't feel the need to complain about something as trivial as a game + people who are satisfied. The .x% are the children who feel they've been ripped off because they're $50 didn't buy them endless happiness....

Bizarro_Jesus · Aug 11, 2005, 04:53 PM // 16:53

I've been playing Guild Wars for a solid 30 days now. It's a decent game and like any software program has it's good points and low points.

Kurow · Aug 11, 2005, 04:55 PM // 16:55

wow this thread is hella trivial.

Silmor · Aug 11, 2005, 05:07 PM // 17:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

I didn't say 99.x% are satisfied. I said 99.x% is comprised of Adults who don't feel the need to complain about something as trivial as a game + people who are satisfied. The .x% are the children who feel they've been ripped off because they're $50 didn't buy them endless happiness....

So you're generalizing that everyone who complains is childish, and those that don't are mature. It ends right there, arguing with stupidity like that is pointless.

Loviatar · Aug 11, 2005, 05:20 PM // 17:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silmor

Gee, most of the people who didn't leave the game yet are still having fun? No kidding, Einstein. That remains true even if 99% of the players already quit the game - the remaining 1% still has fun, so it's a rather pathetic argument why ArenaNet shouldn't worry about people being dissatisfied.

no

i was stating that the most rabid of BOTH extreams are leaving/have gone and that those people were never the intended target group of the buying population.

therefore their leaving/not buying is no concern to their business model

if they drop money on the first one that is gravy that was not xpected to begin with.

i am saying they seem to be aiming at (and pleasing) a specific game buying segment

no more no less

Arton · Aug 11, 2005, 05:45 PM // 17:45

I have played for 300 hours for about $50. That is about 16 cents an hour. I think I have got my moneys worth. Any improvements or updates are just icing on the cake. I can wait for them.

Damon Windwalker · Aug 11, 2005, 06:00 PM // 18:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silmor

So you're generalizing that everyone who complains is childish, and those that don't are mature. It ends right there, arguing with stupidity like that is pointless.

I think this is the overall point:

Is the game perfect? I don't think anyone is saying that it is.

Converseley - will this game (or any game, for that matter) be everything that everyone wants it to be? Of course not.

So like most games - it comes out - there's a rush to get it. Some people (like some of my friends) play it through - they are done, they move onto something else.

Others play it, find out it isn't really what they wanted - and they move on.

Of those who stick it out - many enjoy it, despite what frustrations they may have with it. Others throw tantrums and hand out ultimatums, demanding that the game be made the way they want it to be "or else!." When they leave, good riddance.

I agree with the sentiment that was stated re: "children who expect $50 to buy them eternal happiness." Heck - I spent more money than this on HL2, and got less play time out of it than I have with this so far. I didn't throw a fit over it - I just cleaned up the drive space, put the game on the shelf. Probably sometime when I'm bored, I'll reinstall it and play it again. So goes the world of gaming.

GhostPoet · Aug 11, 2005, 07:09 PM // 19:09

It happens with every mmo and online games in general. People want something added..they think they are the center of the universe. And when it doesn't happen they moan and whine.

Not oddly enough I've noticed it's mainly the "spoiled american brat" type of person that seems to complain the most. The "me me me! I want it now! I want it my way!!" type of people...which is dominant in our country.

OneArmedScissor · Aug 11, 2005, 07:22 PM // 19:22

I hate people that think they're getting a "free" game and force their beliefs on people that they should not complain about anything, etc. Bullshit. I paid $50 for this game along with many other people. Consequently it is NOT a free game. So stop trying to milk that argument for all it's worth.

Xonic · Aug 11, 2005, 07:36 PM // 19:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by GhostPoet

Not oddly enough I've noticed it's mainly the "spoiled american brat" type of person that seems to complain the most. The "me me me! I want it now! I want it my way!!" type of people...which is dominant in our country.

not enough spanking during the childhood to set them straight, I tell you

Loviatar · Aug 11, 2005, 07:45 PM // 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneArmedScissor

I hate people that think they're getting a "free" game and force their beliefs on people that they should not complain about anything, etc. Bullshit. I paid $50 for this game along with many other people. Consequently it is NOT a free game. So stop trying to milk that argument for all it's worth.

what they mean is that you dont have to keep on paying just to play it like eq wow ff etc.

no the original game is not free but at least you dont have to play even if you dont feel like it because it is continuing to cost you money even if you are not playing
and yes i have things i would liked fixed/added but there is a limit to reasonable whineing

Dax · Aug 11, 2005, 08:08 PM // 20:08

Firstly, I'm glad that there are people enjoying this game. but having said that I think most of the griping comes from the fact that the game is too casual.

I know that seems odd, but consider this: The game has been out only a few months and many people have breezed through the game several times, there have been countless ways people have exploited the game, and even now people complain that they have to 'grind' to get ahead.

Xonic · Aug 11, 2005, 08:11 PM // 20:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Firstly, I'm glad that there are people enjoying this game. but having said that I think most of the griping comes from the fact that the game is too casual.

I know that seems odd, but consider this: The game has been out only a few months and many people have breezed through the game several times, there have been countless ways people have exploited the game, and even now people complain that they have to 'grind' to get ahead.

is this GW is about? not a lot of level grind, but just enough for players to learn the game and prepare for PvP?

at least in all the reviews I've read, all the marketing lines from ANet, on all the game boxes I've seen, and I think many parts of the game manual hinted/said that too. and the name of the game is... drum rolls.... Guild Wars!

PvP, GvG.